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In this episode of the Full Stack Sales Pro Josh Alltop is joined by the man, the myth, the legend Taylor Welch for part one of their in-depth discussion on Taylor’s journey and rise in the sales world.

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Taylor (00:00):

The motive matters more than almost anything else, are people being crazy and rowdy because they want to embarrass someone else or are they being fanatically consumed and obsessed with the craft?

Josh (00:31):

What up full stack crew, how are you guys doing today? We have an absolutely amazing episode. Obviously, you know, the person that we’re interviewing today is an absolute freaking legend, but also is just an extremely close friend. And I would let my kids hang out with them. So that should mean something to you, but either way, we’re super excited to dive in and I can’t wait for y’all to just gain as much knowledge as you can. So grab a notepad or just sit back and relax, and it’s gonna be an awesome ride. I wanna talk to you about a lot of things, but how are you doing today? Let me first start there.

Taylor (01:03):

Amazing. And your kids would make more money. The more they hang out with me. So maybe, maybe should set that up more often.

Josh (01:09):

I actually will do that.

Taylor (01:11):

Bring ’em over. They can watch Kate. We’ll be good. Yeah.

Josh (01:13):

I, absolutely love it. We’ll do that.

Taylor (01:16):

I’m doing, I’m doing so good. I’m glad you’re here. I was talking about before, like I don’t get to talk like this very often. Yeah. About just, just sales, just management. Just team. Yeah. So I’m excited.

Josh (01:27):

Yeah. I’m super excited. I want to open up because there is a lot that goes into obviously running a business on so many levels and more than even I can understand. And I know you could talk to that, but in specific regards to just sales, sales, leadership, sales training, I mean, there’s gonna be a lot of people that are watching this or understanding this or listening to this, or just like, you know, I just got my first, you know, AE or I just got my first SDR. Maybe I’m transitioning from being on the phone to, you know, actually running a team and you’ve gone through that multiple times. And I’m just really curious. I’d love to hear like your thoughts, like a, maybe just how you got into doing sales and then how that transitioned to leading and then growing a conglomerate that you’ve grown

Taylor (02:12):

Yeah. I got into sales, I think accidentally I was, as you know, a copywriter. Yeah. So I was doing sales, but not like phone sales. I wasn’t a salesperson. In the copywriting world, we kind of referred to copy as salesmanship in print. So we would write words on pages. We would send it to people and then they would buy it without ever talking to us. Which is magical by the way, if you’ve never tried that, it’s just like, you know, the ability to make money and sell to a hundred people at the same time is pretty cool. The problem is, you know, we had a natural limit on the pricing. So like when you get into monetization paths and like the, the things that I tend to teach our teams is like the, the five Ts think talk, transact, traffic, and team, that transaction path you’re limited if you don’t know how to talk to people.

Taylor (03:09):

So I took my first sales call with a guy named Gary in 2015, I was struggling to sell a $400 product –  like struggling. And he was like, at the end of the call, he was like, I think I’m in. And I was like, cool, I’ll call you tomorrow. He’s like, well, why don’t you just, I’m in, I’ll call you tomorrow. He was like, why don’t you just take my money now? I was like, I don’t know how I don’t, I don’t know how to do it. I’ve never done a sales call before. I’m used to writing copy and Gary his name, I think his name was Gary Zeman. This was many years ago. He was kind enough to walk me through how to set up a PayPal account and take his credit card information. It sounds so crazy now. Yeah, but that was my first ever sales call.

Taylor (03:55):

You know, me really well. Yeah. So, you know, my personality and I’m as obsessive as they come. So once I got my first sale, it was over within about eight months. I had done 1500 calls, like I just completely lost my mind, obsessive. Yeah. and what I realized is that the things that make you a good copywriter make you a really good salesperson as well. Cuz that’s like the, the secrets of persuasion. And you’re not writing it now you’re speaking it. Anyways. There’s a lot we can go into on this from a background standpoint or whatever. But the first time that I closed a $10,000 deal, the first time I closed a $20,000 deal, it just, I was like, can I close a 50,000? Can I get a hundred thousand? And I remember my first salesperson ever, that ever came on the team, his name was Tavius. And,man, I was getting a haircut in Memphis. Tennessee saw a Stripe notification come in and I had made like six or $7,000 without being on the phone. And I was like, dude, I’m rich.

I’m the king of the world right now. Yeah. Like I finally figured out how Mark Zuckerberg did it.

Josh (05:12):

   This is it. I’m it I’ve retired.

Taylor (05:14):

This is how They did it little did I know that like Tavius would quit in like three weeks and then I’d have to replace him and then rebuild the team. And then that team would quit. And I just didn’t know how to lead. It’s like with the gift of hindsight, it’s like, man, I was so stupid. But in the moment you always are like, you, you blow out your expectations because you get so excited there. I found out there’s a lot of, a lot of work in building and leading sales teams that I had no idea about, but the process was fun and it was exciting and it’s probably too much detail, but that’s how it started.

Josh (05:42):

No, it’s good. It’s good. Where then, I mean, how did that lead you on the journey of knowing how to develop and build a healthy sales team? Because yeah. You just said you had a bunch of, you know, things not go, right. You know, you didn’t know tap, this was gonna quit in essence.

Taylor (05:57):

Yeah. So how, what does that look like? Like, like yourself, I grew up in the south in football country. My, like, I remember going to LSU games as a kid and back when we had Nick Saban and my dad was pretty high up at Allstate. And so what, what that gave me is an exposure to guys like Coach K and Nick Saban and Lombardi and Belichick and like how these guys handled losing first and foremost, I got to, I watched all of this stuff. We went to church at a place called it was first assembly. It was where Evangel was in Shreveport. Wow. And the booties came out of Evangel and Danny Duran and all those guys. Yeah. And so every Friday night I would go play with my best friends while not watching Evangel play football but man, I, grew up in it, like I was in all of it.

Taylor (06:59):

And so when I was 12, 13, 14, what, what that gave me is just a perspective on like, my dad would take me to these Maxwell se cast back in the day. I think, I don’t know if they do ’em anymore. They would rent out auditoriums and they would just like stream something through a projector. It was the most boring stuff you’ve ever seen in your life. as a kid, I was just like, I don’t wanna listen to like Patrick Lencioni or like any of these business weirdos wearing suits. Yeah. My dad would just as a 12 year old, not now, now, now I’m fascinated by it. But as a 12 year old, my dad was like, just eat your Chick-fil-A and listen. Yeah. You know? And so there was something, something about just constant exposure that I believe taught me a over emphasis on process.

Taylor (07:49):

And not being so connected to outcome is really required to build teams. And if you study anything of Nick Saban, anything, you know that first and foremost, like he’s a process guy. He does not give a shit about the championship. Not even a little bit. He barely celebrates you know, his emphasis is so hardcore on like, what did you do this morning? Are you doing what you said you were going to do? Like, can you win the down? Just win the, win, the play, win the down, win the quarter, win the half you win the game. If you win enough games, you win the championship. It’s like all of it tracks back to the most basic form. So I don’t know that I ever had an epiphany of like, oh man, I’m really good at building teams. I think that it’s more a combination of like, I grew up in team building. Yeah. Because of exposure to the world of sports and church and all those. And then the second is like this being manic enough to not quit when it’s difficult, you will eventually find yourself on the other side of defeat where things are working. Because if you do everything wrong enough times, you just figure out what works. Yeah. It’s not the safest strategy, but it does work.

Josh (09:00):

Okay. And, I actually, I get where you’re coming from because I’m in the same way. Like in essence, we, I would say we, we have similar personalities in the sense, like we’re magnetic. Like we’re gonna take somebody in like people and, I think anyone who’s doing anything great in life, people are drawn to them. Yeah. But in the case of someone who’s really good at delivering on their business and are on something that they’re doing, but they didn’t have that type of upbringing. They didn’t have the Chick-fil-A and the boring, you know, <inaudible> vibes. Yeah. What are some of the practical things that they can practice as they learn some of what is maybe natural for me and you, you know what I mean? What, what would you have them do starting out? 

Taylor (09:42):

Think you have to, you have to fabricate exposure no matter what. Like, if, if you were like, cuz I’ll I’ll honor that and recognize that like I was, you know, someone would say I was privileged that we all are to a certain extent. Right? Like, based on like the fact that you’re alive, you have a little bit of privilege.      like, it’s sometimes the luck of the draw. But you have to fabricate that exposure if you haven’t had it. And so dude, like when we go to events and we ourselves sit and take notes and we’re listening to the speakers and we’re proactively fabricating exposure to something that we want to have more of. I think that that’s the key, like even just listening to a show like this or a video like this, don’t you think that that is in essence, somebody’s replicating the exposure that I, that was forced on me through proactive behavior. . And so I know that that’s not like we, we can get into the tactical nitty gritty, but I’ve always been a proponent of like, if you can teach people simply the strategic thinking, like how to think the tactics are usually gonna be fine, they’re gonna take care of themselves. they’ll pick ’em up accidentally. So there’s no tactic that I know of to get exposure to this level of thinking without just submitting yourself to this level of thinking it’s kind of a linear equation. Does that make sense? Yeah,

Josh (11:02):

No, it does. I mean, I, I completely agree. I think at some point you have to just, you know, the right feelings, follow the right actions. Right. So it’s like at some point you just gotta dive in and just do it and work with it. But I would say that’s why I feel like culture is so powerful though, because what you lack in, you know what is it that you used to say, even when I first started taking calls, it’s like what you lack an experience you gotta make up for in

Taylor (11:30):

Hustle and grit and numbers.

Josh (11:31):

Production in essence, like right. You know, I gotta call more until I can, you know, just start being a sniper with calls of that nature. Sure. Yeah. I think the same thing goes for leadership, right? Like where it’s like, you might not know how to recruit. So what do you have to do? Recruit?

Taylor (11:48):

You have to recruit more than the person who does know how to recruit, right?

Josh (11:52):

Yeah. Because you need to figure out what’s that one quote that you say about recruiting? You said it when we were talking just a second

Taylor (12:00):

Ago from Lombardi.

Josh (12:01):


Taylor (12:03):

Recruiting is not about finding the right players. It’s about eliminating players. That was coach Lombardi. Who said that. Right, right.

Josh (12:11):

But you told it to me. So you said it   

Taylor (12:15):

Crystal, Marty and Taylor, Walter trademark that please. Yeah.

Josh (12:17):

Trademark that a crew. Go ahead and get that. Yeah. All right. Awesome. Can you basically elaborate on that and your experience with your teams?

Taylor (12:27):

So I, I, I believe you was right, but I believe that part of what is missing in a football team that you actually can have in business is sometimes like the culture of a, of a college team or the like, it’s, it’s gonna be a little bit different than the culture of a, you know, like a for-profit organization.    and so recruiting is the ability to, in my opinion, attract through and filter people who you believe are gonna fit the culture. But then retention is a byproduct of the culture. And I don’t mean like a hundred percent retention. The best thing that ever happened to me, this was my aha moment for this. It was about two and a half years ago. And you had brought in a batch of new, closer to join the team. We’re always like, we’re always hiring ours recruiting because there’s always somebody there’s always some young, like hyper talented, like freak of nature. Who’ll come in and kick everybody’s ass and raise the bar. And we’re always looking for that person. We, I think we brought in three or four people to the team and within like four hours, one of ’em had seen the training and hopped up on the meeting was like, yo, this isn’t for me. So I’m not gonna do it.

Taylor (13:39):

And I was like, that’s the best compliment I’ve ever gotten because my culture, like people misunderstand culture, you read like Jim Collins. And he goes through like the business literature of like how healthy cultures develop.

Taylor (13:54):

People think culture is about people staying in niceties and like, everyone’s welcome. And some bullshit liberal ideology. and it’s not culture is about knowing whether this is for me or this is definitely not for me. Yeah. And it, it needs to be very clear. It’s like black and white, like there’s no fitting into the middle so a good culture for the right fit. It will suck that person in. And it’ll be like, oh my gosh, like, this is amazing, Jacob, for instance, , he’s on our team right now. Yeah. I don’t know if you saw him post yesterday. He’s like, when my CEOs want me to be a monster, they, they back me up in being a monster and like, I love it. culture’s sucking him in and then you’ve got people who are like, and I just, I don’t even know if I belong here because, you know, I just want to drink soy milk and not work.

Taylor (14:42):

Yeah. It’s like, wait, it’s not for you. You know? And so a good culture will actually expel out people who are not in, in, in line, like a virus and they just can’t stay. Yeah. So to Lombardi’s point, I think recruiting and culture are both about eliminating players, like eliminating the people who aren’t going to fit, because the worst thing that can happen, man, is you invest all this time into somebody who was never even the right fit, but your culture was too weak to get rid of them. And so they just stayed and stayed, took the investment and then left when you needed them. That’s the worst thing that can happen.

Josh (15:12):

Yeah. And I think what I’ve seen in business owners or in other sales managers is that they’re afraid of having that black or white culture, cuz it means, well, well they, they could leave and it’s, and it’s like, well, let’s get to the root of that. Cuz you’re actually operating from a place of scarcity. You’re actually operating from a place of like, well, but, and, it’s like, that’s not what you want because at the end of the day, all those soy drinking, you know, people what’s gonna happen. They’re not gonna be able to produce if they don’t produce then money doesn’t come in. If money doesn’t come in, you’re not actually taking care of people and you’re gonna fire ’em anyways. Yeah. So you might as well just get ’em the hell off the team before you have to push them off the team because they didn’t do their

Taylor (15:53):

This is, this is not every department, right. This is really hardcore sales departments. Like operations is a little different, like, you know, but to an extent it’s always, always the same. I’ll say another thing in regards to sales culture is man. Sometimes people misconstrue somebody being difficult or high maintenance as the wrong cultural fit. But I think that when you find a real winner, like this is the difference between being a Ferrari and a Toyota and no offense to anybody who has a Toyota. I don’t, I don’t care. Yeah. It’s the difference in the upkeep required for the vehicles or let’s just take it in, take it a step further, a Ferrari and a twin engine jet you know, every single time that jet lands they’re having to do checkups on it’s high maintenance bro.

Taylor (16:48):

like it’s high maintenance because it’s powerful enough that it could kill you. And so you need to make sure you take care of the things with that power right. The most successful, I don’t know about your experience. I’m really curious from your experience in this, but the most successful sales reps that I’ve ever trained or developed tend to be the most difficult. Yeah. And I mean that in all possible senses of the word. Yeah. and I started reading, there’s a guy named bill Campbell who he coached the founders of Google, apple. I mean, they call him the trillion dollar coach. He passed away a couple of years ago. And he’s, he has a memoir or a book out and, and I’ve read through it several times and grabbed a lot of quotes. And he said that your top performers on the most difficult and you want ’em on your team? I was like, oh, okay. That popped in a missing piece for me. because I think for the longest time I was like, just come in, do your job, shut up and do your job or leave. But I think that there’s an inherent balance or trade off. Like you can’t get, you cannot get a powerful sales team without having a little bit of a mess. that’s why you need management. help contain and clean up that mess. because they’re just gonna run. Yeah.

Josh (18:01):

It’s like I was talking to a guy, I was at an event not too long ago and this guy runs the largest podcast for soccer. Like, but it’s like premier soccer. I mean, they have the largest podcasts and we’re also like FIFA contacts them when they’re gonna launch something and I’m talking to ’em and we’re on this boat and you know, this is not a boat. This was freaking a yacht. This is John Wayne’s actual boat, by the way, which it’s called the goose or the great goose or I don’t know whatever it is, but it is bonkers anyway. So we’re chatting, we’re talking and he was like, you know, do you like soccer? And we get into it. And I’m like, oh, oh my God, I love it. And he’s like, he’s like, and he’s like from Belgium or something, he’s like, oh, you have American and you like soccer.

Josh (18:41):

And I was like, I love that. I was like, I have season tickets to our local club here. I was like, I get up at Saturday morning at 6:00 AM and watch, you know, man city play. And he’s like, da, da, da. And he’s like, why doesn’t America? Like soccer and he’s. And I was like, well, you know, da, da, da. And I gave him some Man City. He goes, no, why don’t you like soccer? And I was like, you guys, I was like, America has no stars. We have no prima donnas. We have no, I was like, Americans love the drama. I like, look at the NBA. They love LeBron. There’s nothing but drama with that dude. Kyrie, nothing but drama. Katie drama. Look at the NFL, Tara Owen. Ochoco when you look at the best of the best, it’s normally they’re causing problems off the field. You’re constantly just managing the chaos. Yeah. For that one moment. Yep. Of greatness that wins you the championship.

Taylor (19:30):

Well, dude, I was even asking you a couple weeks ago. Cause you came over to watch UFC and oh yeah. Yeah. Like I’m learning how to, I’m learning how to get into it. And I was like, what’s the do with Connor McGregor? Like he’s the most famous fighter of all time. And he is like, that dude is like half in jail, half not in jail, like just crazy man. Yep. Same thing.

Josh (19:51):

Floyd, Floyd weather. Yeah. I mean, it’s just like

Taylor (19:54):

Tyson just beat that dude on the plane deserve by the

Taylor (19:57):

Dude. Did you see day whites, Instagram, where he is like how to survive Mike Tyson when he gets on your just get up. Give him your scene to walk away.

Josh (20:05):


Taylor (20:06):

That was amazing. 

Josh (20:06):

Is true though. But like I think with business owners, would you say more times while they’ll get rid of a high performer because of the problems with that? Cause they’re just like, oh, I just can’t deal with that. Or that they’re not fitting into the system. Why do you think that is?

Taylor (20:21):

I think it’s because we have, we don’t, business owners and entrepreneurs and people in general struggle to recognize dichotomies, especially, especially dichotomies. Like, let me give you an example from yesterday. Okay. All right. We’ll just go super recent. Yeah. one of the teams that we manage, you know, I’m roughing it up. they used to see me there. Yeah. Like just having the time of my life. I don’t get to, I don’t get to lead directly. And that picture, like it’s like Nick Saban who wasn’t able to coach anymore. I’m like, so sometimes even you you’re like, yo, I wouldn’t go into that meeting right now, but you got bigger things that you probably like, but I want to, yeah. I sometimes I miss it. Yeah. Anyways, it’s one of the teams that I’m roughing up and they had a record day and that intensity produces results.

Taylor (21:07):

But then it also produces problems. because then people are afraid or like if you take it into other staff, like, or other teams or      . And so what we have to recognize is like, there’s, there’s a time to be this way. And then there’s a time to be a different way and you have to learn to be appropriate in the moment. I think it was Keith Cunningham. Who said success? No, no, no. Anyway, I don’t know who it was. It wasn’t Keith it’ll come to me later. Gary Keller that’s who it was. And the one thing he said success is about being appropriate in the moment.

Taylor (21:40):

That sums everything up. I’ve tried to break that it doesn’t, it’s not it’s unbreakable. like success is literally about being appropriate in that moment. which means there is a time to be aggressive that is appropriate. There is a time to not be aggressive. That would be inappropriate.      . And so as a business owner, we like things that are cut and dry and they make sense all the time. And it’s a system, right? It’s just like, but the system of running sales teams is more nuanced than that because you have to be appropriate in the moment. And there are many different moments. And so what happens, dude, if you put a manager over a we’ve done this a thousand times, you put a sales team under a manager that doesn’t understand the nuance of the different moments. Then they just take all the, a players turn ’em into C players. because they can’t be appropriate in the moment. Yeah. And it, we don’t like that because it’s not cut and dry. Yeah. It requires nuance. We can’t codify it. that’s a problem.

Josh (22:33):

Yeah. one of the players that I think it is one of the players that you roughed up and I’m only saying that, cuz you said it had a record day.

Josh (22:45):

I called him and this is what I want people to take away from this. Especially in the training that they’re watching, this is what a healthy culture looks like when, as an ecosystem, we work together. So I called him and I hadn’t actually not talked to this person before. I was like, Hey, do you want some advice? That’s my first question to he’s like anything from you? I was like, here’s my cell, call me right now. He calls me. And I went through and I walked him through how to leverage what happened. I was like, I want you to take what happened in the morning. Now I want you to document it. Now I want you to take what you did this day. And now I want you to show you how you leveraged that for the next six months.

Josh (23:25):

And then how in six months when you’re probably back here again, because you’re a salesperson, you’re gonna be a little bitch at some point. Yeah. Like you have bread crumbs to realize how great you are. Yeah. And it like blew his mind because we bow it. Like we put a bow on the, the day of like the, what was needed was that intensity. And then it was also like the attaboy and okay. Now how here’s, how you leverage it. And I mean, you just, it was just like, so when you’ve had, well, let me ask you this. Have you ever had a sales manager not work out?

Taylor (24:01):

Yeah. Okay. Many times.

Josh (24:03):

What do you, what is the normal cause of a, a sales manager not working out and then how do you make up and make sure that the culture isn’t sacrificed when you have to transition ’em or different things of that nature?

Taylor (24:16):

There’s probably a lot of reasons why certain managers don’t work out sometimes it’s, you know, skill, sometimes experience. But let me just kind of roll through some of the things that come top of mind. I’ve had managers in the past get more committed to an individual player than the team. it always sinks the boat. it’s like you can never become more committed to one person than you are to the whole organization. What’ll happen is like everyone on the team will begin hating that person because they know that they’re a C player and they’re just like being left on the team for no, but they’re losing because of that person. And it creates this weird bitter culture and then nobody trusts the manager anymore, you know? And so this is another thing you can, like there was a documentary for a season.

Taylor (25:10):

I don’t know if it’s still online about Belichick and Saban and you know, they talk about this, like the commitment to the team. It’s all about the team. It’s all about the team. Being a good coach is a prioritization of the team over everything else. And so commitment to an individual, even if it’s family, even if it’s your friend, your boy, your girl, like whatever is going to break the team. If you, if you let it override, does that make sense? anytime you have a manager who is expecting people to do what they themselves are not willing to do, that will break the team. People tend to underestimate the importance of actually having authority over what you’re asking people to do. And it sounds like I’m not trying to go spiritual or move on it. I’m just like, if, if you haven’t been through the fire, you can’t really expect your team to go through the fire.

Because they’ll just be like, well, no,   , you know, they’re not gonna trust it. sometimes it’s as simple as taking a top performing sales rep, bump them into management positions, thinking that the skill sets needed to run a really good book of business translate to the skill needed to manage the team. And it’s like, no. Yeah. They’re different skill sets.      . And so you want to be real careful when you’re like, well, this person’s crushing it. I’m just gonna promote ’em because two things like one, they may not be a good manager, just cuz they’re good, closer doesn’t mean they’re gonna be a good manager and two they’re probably not gonna like it because they’re not good at it. They’re gonna be excited in the moment. But then what happens when they’re like, well, I don’t even feel good. Like I’m good at this anymore. And you end up, I’ve lost top producers and top performers because I put ’em into management, they sucked at it. And then they were so demoralized from an ego standpoint that they, it was easier for them to leave than go back to producing. Yeah. They would go somewhere else and produce and crush it. And it’s like, great. Let’s train this person to just give it away, you know? Yeah. Yeah.

Josh (27:10):

It’s kinda like, you know, that statement I think it was even brought up yesterday. It’s like those who can do and those who can’t teach and it’s like, you’s the dumbest shit I have ever heard because those who can, can’t always teach. And that’s, to me, what makes a phenomenal leader is someone who can and can teach it. I think that’s, I mean, you know, yeah. I don’t blow smoke over you, but I think that’s what set you apart. And what’s set the team apart is the ability that you could hop on a call right now and close somebody because you, you understand the nuances, the tactics, you understand the ability to yeah. Uncover correctly and all that. But you also know how to transfer that.

Taylor (27:49):


Josh (27:50):

How do you set those type of standards in your culture? How do you create those and then hold people to that?

Taylor (27:56):

Well, I do still hop on the phone to stay sharp. Yeah. Like I don’t wanna, I don’t wanna lose

Josh (28:03):

You still take a call if you need to.

Taylor (28:04):

Yeah. A hundred percent. Wow. Yeah. Because if, if, if I lose certainty ever, you know this like yeah. If you lose certainty for a moment, it’s just like, especially if you have a team of killers, it’s just blood in the streets. So you have to maintain certainty and conviction at all times. And so at, at every moment of the day, like I know I’m, I’m the best closer in the building. People want the good ones. Yeah. They want to challenge that. Yeah. And I love it. It doesn’t, it doesn’t mean that it doesn’t mean that I feel threatened. Yeah. If I walk into the pit and I’m like, I’m the best closer in this entire building and everyone just looks at me, I’m like, shit, dude, we just got a weak team flip the team. Yeah. Flip ’em, you know,      like, I want everybody to be like, yeah, let’s see your numbers, scoreboard.

Taylor (28:56):

Let’s go. Like, I want, you know, a closers in pocket when they don’t care. They’ll fight you. Right. Then doesn’t they don’t care about your hierarchy. Yeah. Like they’ll tackle you down to the ground. Like, let’s go. Yeah. They care about winning. They care about momentum and outcome, right? Yeah. Like this is what was so hard for me in the beginning. It’s because I had never learned this. And so when I would get a really good team, they’d piss me off and I’d fire ’em. It was like, well, they’re supposed to piss you off. Yeah. Like they’re difficult. Yeah. They got ego they’re rally, you know? And so I think back way back in the beginning with like painting and Cole, I had two guys training them both and they would piss me off so bad dude. Yeah. I would get so frustrated because they’re like, they think, they think they’re better than me.

Taylor (29:50):

And they think that I’m no big deal and blah, blah, blah. And I would put them in their place because I can, and then they’d stop closing deals. and at certain point I’ve realized the dichotomy. I was like, okay, like this person is actually peak when I’m like, get the F outta my face. Like I can’t stand them. Yeah. That means they’re like peak like, they’re gonna close every deal that they touch. . And if I go in and I like humble them, I take them out of pocket. They can’t close anything because they’ve just been like freaking humiliated by their boss. Yeah. Isn’t that a weird like kind of dichotomy.

Josh (30:27):

Yeah. It is because it’s it’s you have to reverse think or reverse engineer, how you think or reframe or you’re thinking where it’s like, I want them to do the very thing that most people have said, no, you want people to fall in line and you want people cuz there’s a difference. Like, and I’m not gonna, if I still box too much, the, the they’ll just edit all this out. But there’s a freaking difference between unity and uniformity because see uniformity is we look the same. We talk the same. We act the same. And we think that’s culture, we’ll call that DNA. We’ll call that team and family. And it’s like, that’s not unity is actually us coming together despite our differences for one common goal. Yeah. So like when I’m running of teams and, and I’m training people, I’m like, I, I don’t care that you are different or is, is this your end goal?

Josh (31:12):

Yeah. Because if your end goal is to be in, in this sales, cuz that’s what we’re talking about. If your end goal is to literally bring in the most people that we can help possibly help, which brings in revenue, which creates jobs and has all of these byproducts to it. Then I, I don’t care if you’re on Adderall or if what you’re doing, like I just really don’t care. Like what I care is, you know? And because there is that fine line. And I mean, if you want to tell a story, because that would be amazing, but there is that fine line of where it’s like, you, you bring people in and you let them be raw and crazy, but then you also have to keep parameters on them. Totally. You know what I mean? Like, like Alaskan dogs. Yeah. They’re savages, but yet all them hoses are tied to a freaking chain. You know what I mean? It’s like, I dunno if we can say hose, but that’ll be the podcast part, you know, but they’re all tied up in a uniform setting, right.

Taylor (32:03):

There’s parameters, which usually are gonna come down to moral and ethical parameters. But within those parameters it is be as effective as possible for the benefit of the other people around you. Right? Like, and I think that this is like, this is what makes my style unique more than anything else is when we talk about tactics, other people are gonna give you a 10 point checklist and, and whatever. And sometimes it works. Sometimes it doesn’t. But when we talk, when we talk about culture, it’s stay inside the ethical and moral boundaries. But within those boundaries be as effective as possible for the benefit of the client. There are no rules. notice the lack of rules. There is a box go be as effective as you can possibly be. why for the benefit of the motive matters more than almost anything else. so are people being crazy and rowdy because they want to embarrass someone else and like, like beat the hell out of their competition or are they being fanatically out, outrageously consumed and obsessed with the craft because they enrolled somebody named Trina who was broke and now she’s not. And she’s now investing and like, look, the differences here are monumental. 

There are no tactics left for me to teach if I take somebody and I’m like, you just saved that young woman’s life. She got two kids. She married the wrong dude, or let’s flip it around. You just saved that young man’s life, single dad, whatever, paint the picture. However you want these stories happen. Yep. You’ve seen them how you’ve been a part of them and you can decide to be like, that happened one time. And it was like a cool moment in your life. Or you can serve 400, 500, 600 of them a year, but you’re gonna have to be committed and obsessed, bro. There’s no tactics that I can do that will beat that person out. like, because they will just continue. They will outwork everyone else. The motive keeps your drive alive.

Josh (34:17):

Yeah. How do you keep, how do you teach that to your sales people? Again, like let’s use the frame cuz it’s different for you. You know what I mean? Like you, you have multiple sales teams at this moment of your career and future and everything like that for the person who’s got the two closers two, you know, two advisors, SDS, whatever, you know, how do they keep drive alive and sustainable?

Taylor (34:43):

So I think there’s different ways to attach this or like attack this. I’ve found that what a lot of people do is they take for granted the things that they do that are to be celebrated. Mm. So you take a, take a client who, you know, you, you pick a niche and pick a product and we’ve probably helped them do it. The things that they do, they do it so well. And they do it so often that it becomes familiar to them. Mm. And they no longer feel that it’s that special. It’s just kind of what they do to make money. Right. If you can reset the team back to like an actual, healthy place of thinking, then you begin celebrating the wins of your clients, celebrating the improvements that you’ve offered your clients, like your, your clients feel more protected, more engaged, more prosperous, like whatever it is that you do, I don’t know what you do, but you’re likely offering a benefit to the end user that is big enough that they feel like it’s worth paying for.

Taylor (35:45):

Right. if you just pause every day and you talk about that benefit five days, go by and you’ve been to flip the team because all of a sudden, like they’re no longer feeling familiar or entitled to it. You know, like imposter cinema for the most of us is really about taking the things that are really unique and, and special about us and feeling like that’s something that everyone has. And then we forget that we’re unique. Mm. You know, and that has same thing happens in business. Yeah. You know, like I can tell you a story after story people were just like, they came in, they thought their products was just like, everyone else did it. And I’m like, no one does this. Like when’s the last time you sat with your sales team and you just talked about clients. They’re like, never, we just talk about numbers. Like, oh, you’re missing it. like, because the numbers only really are the scoreboard of the byproduct of the thing that you’re changing for people in the first place.

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